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Re: NetView User Groups (was[nv-l] another list)

To: nv-l@lists.us.ibm.com
Subject: Re: NetView User Groups (was[nv-l] another list)
From: Mike Odom <odomm@us.ibm.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 15:04:22 -0600
Delivery-date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 21:16:09 +0000
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Did some research, thanks Becky,  and found this site for user group
management.  What is needed are a couple of individuals who are interested
in starting the user group and willing to get it kicked off (lead).   I can
set up a conference call with someone who can give some direction on how to
get started.  Jane you will find a link to your site already there.  Anyone
interested in leading the user group ?

http://www.tivoli-ug.org/index.php

.
Mike Odom



                                                                                
                                                             
                      "Mike Walsh"                                              
                                                             
                      <Mike.Walsh@us.ing.com>        To:       
nv-l@lists.us.ibm.com                                                         
                      Sent by:                       cc:                        
                                                             
                      owner-nv-l-digest@lists        Subject:  Re: NetView User 
Groups (was[nv-l] another list)                              
                      .us.ibm.com                                               
                                                             
                                                                                
                                                             
                                                                                
                                                             
                      10/17/2003 02:11 PM                                       
                                                             
                      Please respond to nv-l                                    
                                                             
                                                                                
                                                             





Jane,

Thanks much for your comments.  The primary part of the situation, in my
view is that Netview are, more or less, the grunts of the Tivoli world.  I
mean, we have to be here to work our systems and provide support, the
Tivoli types look at us as too low on the totem pole for such things.  I
didn't even know about Planet Tivoli until it was happening.  Naturally,
travel and other arrangements were too late.


Mike Walsh
****Please Note - New EMAIL Address  mike.walsh@us.ing.com*********
612-342-3118



                      Jane Curry

                      <jane.curry@skills        To:
nv-l@lists.us.ibm.com

                      -1st.co.uk>               cc:

                                                Subject:  NetView User
Groups (was[nv-l] another list)
                      10/17/2003 01:16

                      PM

                      Please respond to

                      nv-l






I agree with Mike about the value of User Groups and the dearth of
NetView user groups.  The problem seems to be that no-one currently has
education or travel budget, and when they did, we were still a
relatively sparse community when spread around the globe.

I believe that the Germans DO have a NetView User Group - can anyone
comment on if / how that works?

Another suggestion is to run a BOF (Birds Of a Feather) session at /
after a Tivoli User Group.  I did this at Planet Tivoli in New Orleans
but even with a week's advanced notice, we still only had half a dozen
of us chewing the NetView fat.

I guess it doesn't help Mike, but we have a Tivoli User Group meeting in
the UK on November 13th.  If there's interest, I would be very happy to
hold an informal NetView BOF afterwards ("informal" tends to be defined
as "includes beer/ wine / food at a local hostelry on a self-funding
basis").  If there's interest, please respond.  Perhaps others TUGs
could do the same.  Ideally, we need more NetView content on a TUG
agenda, but that means someone has to volunteer...

My 2 pennorth.....
Cheers,
Jane

Mike Walsh wrote:

>Scott and James,
>
>If I can weigh in with my own frustrations.  I am very new to Netview and
>the whole Unix world  Being such, a lot of this stuff goes over my head.
>What disappoints me is that there are no user groups, meetings etc. where
I
>could try to gain added knowledge and expertise.  Nobody I could talk to
>and share information with directly.  I've been to the admin class, and
>while Charlie Carter is very, very good at teaching, he only has a few
days
>to beat everything into our heads.
>
>I mean the Tivoli bunch have one that meets regularly.  Why not Netview.
>Guess it is because we are a poor cousin to Tivoli and so overworked and
>under-maned in the business world that we could never get away regardless.
>
>Mike Walsh
>****Please Note - New EMAIL Address  mike.walsh@us.ing.com*********
>612-342-3118
>
>
>
>                      "Barr, Scott"
>                      <Scott_Barr@csgsy        To:
nv-l@lists.us.ibm.com
>                      stems.com>               cc:
>                                               Subject:  RE: [nv-l]
another list
>                      10/15/2003 01:20
>                      PM
>                      Please respond to
>                      nv-l
>
>
>
>
>
>Well, I will weigh in on this from a different perspective.
>
>I think the mailing list and a newsgroup both have significant
limitations.
>In this day and age, more facilities should be available for a user
>community than just a simple email thread. If you look around at other
>software products and their support forums, you see a feature list like
>this:
>
>1. Message threads / bulletin board
>2. Download area for user contributions (i.e. let me share my script /
>rulesets with you)
>3. Chat room for online meetings with product experts
>4. Patches
>5. Documentation
>6. Surveys / questionnaires
>7. Enhancement requests
>
>Just to draw a parallel - I play online games. If you go look at the
>support site for a user community from one of the popular MMORPGs you find
>a suite of tools and features that is quite robust and usually these are
>supported by fans without a lot of capital to pay for fancy features -
they
>just use whats easily obtained and create some DAMN good web sites to
>support their "guilds". It is extremely annoying to me, that the user
>community for NetView is still living in the text only 1970s bulletin
board
>format.
>
>I don't really have a preference about news vs. email, I just hate the
>limited feature set for support so we have to keep answering the same
>questions for folks over and over (no threads so we can't have a sticky
>topic with FAQs) - no download area so we can't share files / scripts,
etc.
>
>
>   -----Original Message-----
>   From: owner-nv-l-digest@lists.us.ibm.com
>   [mailto:owner-nv-l-digest@lists.us.ibm.com]On Behalf Of James Shanks
>   Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2003 10:30 AM
>   To: nv-l@lists.us.ibm.com
>   Subject: RE: [nv-l] another list
>
>
>
>   Folks,
>
>   I sent a posting to this list a couple days ago, which I don't seem to
>   be able to find any more, so I'll try again.
>
>   I inquired about this and was told that a  Tivoli executive had ordered
>   the creation of this NetView  newsgroup so that he could say that all
>   Tivoli products, like all IBM products, had one.  Furthermore, the
>   mention of the newsgroup in the next version of each product's Release
>   Notes was also mandated.  No one in my group nor in NetView development
>   even saw this boiler plate before the ID group replaced that  book on
>   the CD.  It was not considered technical content and therefore was not
>   given to them to review.  That's why the nv-l list was not mentioned
>   there as well.   I have already escalated this and I think that will be
>   rectified in the Release Notes to the first FixPack for 7.1.4.
>
>   As for the newsgroup itself, even the people who created it say that
>   they do not think of it is a replacement for the nv-l list, which they
>   admit is monitored by people with much more expertise than any
newsgroup
>   is.
>
>   So my advice is that, as users, you "vote with your feet" as it were
and
>   use the vehicle you prefer.   This list is your forum after all; it was
>   started by customers for customers, and until it suddenly needed a home
>   and a Tivoli guy volunteered to rescue it, it  was not maintained by
IBM
>   at all.  If you choose not to participate on the newsgroup, you  need
>   not.  I don't plan to, myself.
>
>
>   James Shanks
>   Level 3 Support  for Tivoli NetView for UNIX and Windows
>   Tivoli Software / IBM Software Group
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

--
Tivoli Certified Consultant & Instructor
Skills 1st Limited, 2 Cedar Chase, Taplow, Bucks, SL6 0EU, UK
Tel: +44 (0)1628 782565
Copyright (c) 2003 Jane Curry <jane.curry@skills-1st.co.uk>.  All rights
reserved.











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